918 replies to this topic

[shuttlewrth]

I'm running something like this:

http://gw2skills.net...P vHcCDgxZsLyCA

With scholar runes atm and a force sigil.  All zerker ascended except the hammer is exotic

Edit:  If you want the full build, utilities and all, I can make it really quick for ya but I figured all you really need is the traits.  Glass cannon and the vulnerability increase damage trait really buff your initial burst damage.  I use the whirl gyro on thunderclap for vuln stacks.

[Slein Jinn]

shuttlewrth, on 01 November 2015 - 11:48 AM, said:

Hey silvers, don't know if your at work or something but if you get the chance check out marauder and crusader stats for gear.  Tell me you don't see tanky bruiser scraper with a mix set of those two.  Think I found my new wvw set

I haven't sat down and run any calculations on it yet, but my intuition is that Marauder+Crusader will be an inefficient way to build those stats.  I'll run the numbers later if I remember.

Silvernis, on 01 November 2015 - 12:14 PM, said:

I should just suck it up and level leatherworking and armorsmithing, but...crafting.

What's so bad about crafting?  GW2's crafting system is pretty painless.  You can follow the guides HERE and have any discipline mastered in literally a matter of minutes.  Getting to 500 is a bit more demanding, but even that's not bad.

[shuttlewrth]

Maruader and crusader will be more a wvw build, not pve.  Will be using nades and hammer obviously.  Playing similar to a static discharge build.  Probably those used for the actual armor and the trinkets as zerker still, maybe knights if it's still to squishy.

[opals]

Slein Jinn, on 01 November 2015 - 05:48 PM, said:

I haven't sat down and run any calculations on it yet, but my intuition is that Marauder+Crusader will be an inefficient way to build those stats.  I'll run the numbers later if I remember.


What's so bad about crafting?  GW2's crafting system is pretty painless.  You can follow the guides HERE and have any discipline mastered in literally a matter of minutes.  Getting to 500 is a bit more demanding, but even that's not bad.

sometimes getting mats can be a real headache, which is personally why crafting isn't something i could say i particularly enjoy. getting from 400 to 500 for anything other than food is also really expensive. my two cents if you don't mind them. Haha

[Silvernis]

Slein Jinn, on 01 November 2015 - 05:48 PM, said:

What's so bad about crafting?  GW2's crafting system is pretty painless.  You can follow the guides HERE and have any discipline mastered in literally a matter of minutes.  Getting to 500 is a bit more demanding, but even that's not bad.

Crafting isn't difficult, but it's utterly, ridiculously, unfathomably tedious. Take 1000 widgets, stand there while they turn into 500 other widgets, and then stand there some more while those become 1 widget, and then do it all over again and again and again so you can eventually make the stuff you actually wanted in the first place. I mean...why? What is the point? There's no skill, there's no learn to play, there's no nothing. It's just standing there not doing a goddamned thing. It's busywork that doesn't need to exist in anything like its current form. Seriously, I don't know why so many games insist on including crafting.

That goes double for sinister and cele and the other stats that you can't buy with karma, gold, or tokens. Why can we buy the stat sets that shipped with the game, but not the new ones? Why do we have to go through the brain-melting stupidity of crafting to get some stats, but not others?

It's also expensive. I sure don't have heaps of gold lying around to buy all those fucking overpriced mats, so no, I can't just max it in literally a matter of minutes.

[/strongfeelings]

[shuttlewrth]

I didn't know you were that passionate about crafting silvers O.o

I do agree that they should have made the new stat stuff accessible from map tokens or something.  I have all crafts maxed, still don't want to go through the headache of figuring out what all I need to make a pair of pants sometimes.

Btw silvers, have you tried that trait setup I linked you?  If so, are you getting numbers more similar to what I was getting?

[Silvernis]

The fact that you don't have access to all stats through non-crafting routes—WvW merchants, dungeon merchants, or karma merchants, whatever—is what really bugs me. GW2's schtick was supposed to be about playing how you wanted to play, which included not dealing with crafting if you didn't enjoy crafting, yet now they're just gating all the new stuff behind crafting. Like, oh, you want to try this stat combo because it could help with your build and playstyle, but you'll have to jump through all these hoops first. It just pisses me off.

And I'm going to try that vuln trait. I also realized that I was stupid and neglected to swap out the rest of my accessories. I should get substantially higher numbers once I slot more power gear.

[shuttlewrth]

For sure.  Highest I've seen that hammer 2 skill hit was 10k in the fractals we were doing.  That was running firearms, explosives and scrapper though.

[Slein Jinn]

shuttlewrth, on 01 November 2015 - 05:58 PM, said:

Maruader and crusader will be more a wvw build, not pve.  Will be using nades and hammer obviously.  Playing similar to a static discharge build.  Probably those used for the actual armor and the trinkets as zerker still, maybe knights if it's still to squishy.

Right, I get that, but what I'm saying is that you can probably have a higher combined value of damage and tankiness by using other sets.  The stats on Marauder+Crusader aren't distributed in the most efficient way.  I'll have to run some actual numbers on it some time, but my first impression is that the balance of stats will yield worse results than other similar combinations would.

Silvernis, on 01 November 2015 - 06:34 PM, said:

Crafting isn't difficult, but it's utterly, ridiculously, unfathomably tedious. Take 1000 widgets, stand there while they turn into 500 other widgets, and then stand there some more while those become 1 widget, and then do it all over again and again and again so you can eventually make the stuff you actually wanted in the first place. I mean...why? What is the point? There's no skill, there's no learn to play, there's no nothing. It's just standing there not doing a goddamned thing. It's busywork that doesn't need to exist in anything like its current form. Seriously, I don't know why so many games insist on including crafting.

Sure, it's tedious, but you can easily do it whilst doing something else--watching TV, chatting with friends, even reading this forum.  GW2's big improvement on most previous MMO crafting systems is that it's mostly "fire-and-forget"--you can queue up a whole bunch of something and then think about something else while they assemble rather than having to click each component for each attempt each time.  And, whilst I'm certainly not going to try to argue that there's real "skill" in leveling up crafting professions, it's not completely mindless--or at least it doesn't have to be.  Whenever I do it, I look at it like an optimisation equation, where I try to find the path that is the most self-sufficient (i.e. uses stuff I already have laying around) and least expensive.  Is it "fun" per se?  Not really, but it is adequately stimulating, especially when combined with other things you can do multitasking.  And there is a certain satisfaction to the self-sufficiency of being able to make your own stuff (RIFT did one better on that, though, including the name of the crafter on the stats panel for any crafted items).

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That goes double for sinister and cele and the other stats that you can't buy with karma, gold, or tokens. Why can we buy the stat sets that shipped with the game, but not the new ones? Why do we have to go through the brain-melting stupidity of crafting to get some stats, but not others?

Right or wrong, ANet's stated position has been that the base stat combinations are sufficient to play a variety of adequate builds for any profession, and the additional stat combinations are gated to provide additional options to more dedicated players.

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It's also expensive. I sure don't have heaps of gold lying around to buy all those fucking overpriced mats, so no, I can't just max it in literally a matter of minutes.

[/strongfeelings]

What's your standard of "expensive"?  If you follow the guide I linked and take the fastest possible route, having none of the components in advance, Leatherworking--one of the most expensive--costs 38g to get to 400 (as of my writing this post--it fluctuates).  You can take a slightly longer route and get that down to 32g.  And that's assuming you have to buy everything; if you've been playing this game for three years, you'll probably have most of what you need sitting around in your bank already.  When I level a crafting profession, I seldom spend more than 10g out of pocket, and it takes me less than 20 minutes.

[opals]

yawn. so who else is up at this ungodly hour? in the bus towards downtown at 8am is not something that should be done during a vacation week, dammit. can i expect to see sanji or nessa playing once i'm back home in three, four-ish hours?

[Silvernis]

Slein Jinn, on 02 November 2015 - 07:44 AM, said:

Sure, it's tedious, but you can easily do it whilst doing something else--watching TV, chatting with friends, even reading this forum.  GW2's big improvement on most previous MMO crafting systems is that it's mostly "fire-and-forget"--you can queue up a whole bunch of something and then think about something else while they assemble rather than having to click each component for each attempt each time.  And, whilst I'm certainly not going to try to argue that there's real "skill" in leveling up crafting professions, it's not completely mindless--or at least it doesn't have to be.  Whenever I do it, I look at it like an optimisation equation, where I try to find the path that is the most self-sufficient (i.e. uses stuff I already have laying around) and least expensive.  Is it "fun" per se?  Not really, but it is adequately stimulating, especially when combined with other things you can do multitasking.  And there is a certain satisfaction to the self-sufficiency of being able to make your own stuff (RIFT did one better on that, though, including the name of the crafter on the stats panel for any crafted items).

That is all true, though I would whine that I'd rather play the game than stand at a crafting station. Even if it's just bashing stuff in the face in the Silverwastes, it's more engaging than crafting.

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Right or wrong, ANet's stated position has been that the base stat combinations are sufficient to play a variety of adequate builds for any profession, and the additional stat combinations are gated to provide additional options to more dedicated players.

That is such bullshit. People who only play PvP get access to all stats. Why shouldn't it be the same in the rest of the game? Just stick some merchants in WvW or add new sets to the existing dungeon lists or even just make the damn things tradeable.

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What's your standard of "expensive"?  If you follow the guide I linked and take the fastest possible route, having none of the components in advance, Leatherworking--one of the most expensive--costs 38g to get to 400 (as of my writing this post--it fluctuates).  You can take a slightly longer route and get that down to 32g.  And that's assuming you have to buy everything; if you've been playing this game for three years, you'll probably have most of what you need sitting around in your bank already.  When I level a crafting profession, I seldom spend more than 10g out of pocket, and it takes me less than 20 minutes.

35g would be a third of my current funds, so that would be kinda expensive for me. [Edit: I am sitting on a fair number of liquid assets (primarily mats, along with a BL ticket and an exo or two) that could bring in a tidy sum, but I'm hesitant to unload those. Upgrading guild halls will apparently require a crapton of stuff, and who knows what legendary crafting nonsense is in the pipeline.]

opals, on 02 November 2015 - 08:19 AM, said:

yawn. so who else is up at this ungodly hour? in the bus towards downtown at 8am is not something that should be done during a vacation week, dammit. can i expect to see sanji or nessa playing once i'm back home in three, four-ish hours?

[shuttlewrth]

I'm going to be on for a bit in pretty soon.  Mrs is going to a friends house for a couple hours, so I'll be around.

[shuttlewrth]

So I just spent some time follow Mentor W H I S P

[Silvernis]

Did you follow the silk-wrapped apple to death and glory and/or loot?

[Slein Jinn]

Silvernis, on 02 November 2015 - 09:18 AM, said:

That is all true, though I would whine that I'd rather play the game than stand at a crafting station. Even if it's just bashing stuff in the face in the Silverwastes, it's more engaging than crafting.

Stubbornly refusing to spend a tiny amount of time and resources to level crafting just seems an awful lot like cutting off your nose to spite your face.  Even if you think crafting is the most miserable gameplay mechanic you could ever possibly suffer through, refusing to spend a few minutes and a few gold on something that would allow you to have access to all the resources you want to maximise your fun in numerous other areas of the game just seems silly.  Maybe crafting sucks and is stupid, but if you think your character would be improved by having some of the stat combinations that are only available through crafting, it's a minuscule price to pay for the enjoyment you'll get from having the character you want to have.

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That is such bullshit. People who only play PvP get access to all stats. Why shouldn't it be the same in the rest of the game? Just stick some merchants in WvW or add new sets to the existing dungeon lists or even just make the damn things tradeable.

Their argument may or may not be bullshit--I haven't really got a strong opinion and can see both sides--but your counterargument is definitely bullshit.  sPvP is a completely different system the core concept of which is that every player must have an identical set of resources available to them.  You could use your same argument against basically any feature of sPvP--PvP players don't have to unlock Elite Specialisations, why should you? PvP players don't have to work for Ascended gear to have best-in-slot stats, why should you? PvP players don't have to pay to change their Runes/Sigils, why should you? etc.

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35g would be a third of my current funds, so that would be kinda expensive for me. [Edit: I am sitting on a fair number of liquid assets (primarily mats, along with a BL ticket and an exo or two) that could bring in a tidy sum, but I'm hesitant to unload those. Upgrading guild halls will apparently require a crapton of stuff, and who knows what legendary crafting nonsense is in the pipeline.

If you don't sell all the mats you get as drops, you probably have everything you need, or damned close to it.  Leveling crafting skills to 400 doesn't really require anything out of the ordinary for someone who's been playing the game regularly for a prolonged period of time.  Like I said, I can typically get to 400 in any discipline for under 10g out-of-pocket--usually way under.

[opals]

Silvernis, on 02 November 2015 - 02:45 PM, said:

Did you follow the silk-wrapped apple to death and glory and/or loot?

excuse you! it's always to glory. also, yawn again.

[shuttlewrth]

It actually was to glory, not falling off a cliff to our death.  I do that on my own XD. Never an updraft when you need one.

[Silvernis]

Slein Jinn, on 02 November 2015 - 05:14 PM, said:

Their argument may or may not be bullshit--I haven't really got a strong opinion and can see both sides--but your counterargument is definitely bullshit.  sPvP is a completely different system the core concept of which is that every player must have an identical set of resources available to them.  You could use your same argument against basically any feature of sPvP--PvP players don't have to unlock Elite Specialisations, why should you? PvP players don't have to work for Ascended gear to have best-in-slot stats, why should you? PvP players don't have to pay to change their Runes/Sigils, why should you? etc.

Forget I mentioned PvP; it was a poor example. I get that it's a different system with different rules. My point is that everything is available directly. The thing I take umbrage with in PvE/WvW is the fact that the non-base stat sets aren't available in a 1-to-1 method, so to speak—i.e., spend one sum of gold and get one piece of gear from a WvW vendor or from the TP, spend one sum of karma and get one piece of gear from a temple vendor, spend one sum of dungeon tokens and get one piece of gear from the dungeon vendor. If I want cele or sinister or viper or whatever, that's not an option. Those sets have substantially bigger barriers to entry. It doesn't matter if crafting is easy or not; it still means that there are many more hoops that have to be jumped through to acquire them, and I don't see the point. Like I said, just stick them in the existing vendor lists or make them tradeable.

[opals]

where are you guys? :')

[shuttlewrth]

Mrs will be on soon, after the kids go to bed